Yes as the title says this game is massively pay to win.

Now before the trolls and white knights jump onto this post like little sheep without even reading a single thing let me explain.

If you pay money to buy your gear and yes I said buying as your using real money to sell things to make currency in game to then buy gear with. 

Anyways if you pay money you will have a massive advantage over those who do not. Those who pay money will outgear everyone else and be able to own all the good grind spots and challenge and defeat anyone without any skill at all as we all know Gear is better than skill.

Now all the trolls and white knights will come in like sheep and cry "it's not pay to win its pay for convenience" no.. there is no such thing. as those who do not pay will NEVER catch up or be able to grind in the top spots as those who pay.

so how can a person who dont pay get gear to catch up to those who paid and be able to get the same gear they got if the ones who paid dominate the market and the best spots.

they dont.

this game seems as though if anyone here wants a real shot at pvp and be top dog you will have to pay. or forever be stomped in pvp by those who paid.

Please dont lie about how you never paid a penny or so little yet still do good in pvp. you dont. or how you never paid for your gear yet you still do good in pvp. you dont.

the gear gap is just gona get bigger and bigger even now new players stand no chance at all.

so unless they equalise gear in pvp so its skill over gear. pvp in this game will die just like PC. again dont lie and say that pvp is not dead on PC. it is. the only people left on PC are life skillers and role players who like to play dress up so buy outfits on the store and dress up their pony or dress up their house.

only a child or an idiot cant see how pay to win this is.

you pay... you win the ability to brag, 1 shot, kill and dominate anyone in pvp.... without any skill at all.

give it a year and this game will die just like tera did on xbox... just like nevereinter did.... just like skyforge did... xbox players dont like to grind. they like to have fun and kill using skill. that's why shooters are such a big thing on xbox as that takes skill not gear.

imagine if call of duty had gear like black desert and someone got a sniper and headshot someone with huge defense but did no damage.

yeah... no one would stand for it and there would be a huge uproar.

bottom line is this is a pay to win game worst I have ever seen and it dont even hide it either. only an idiot would say it's not.

Are you talking about the people who spend thousands on the 1% PEN chance

or

the people who sell costumes for silver and for 200 dollars make what I can grind in a day or so.

Trying to picture massive advantage here.

In a few days we get awakening. Once you get your awakening weapon up to even pri you'll be able to grind in a hour what people sell costumes for on the market. 

At launch yes spending real money was OP but as time goes by its not going to make a shred of difference 

I saw u are multicomplain about the game. Just go away and dont come back. Its not game for u.  

Don’t let the door hit you on the way out

Who cares still fun

3 hours ago, Doktar said:

Are you talking about the people who spend thousands on the 1% PEN chance

or

the people who sell costumes for silver and for 200 dollars make what I can grind in a day or so.

 

Trying to picture massive advantage here.

My bet is:

The one who played 1k+ hours more and has advantage.

How dare he be better after investing so much more time

Ugh. Again?! May as well name this forum board "Moaning about P2W" 

At a point, cash droppers can no longer advance. Then the rest of us can catch up. So, they're merely conveniently speeding up the process. 

PAY FOR CONVENIENCE

I love the massive amount of assumptions of everyone's experience from this post, and if you say something different from his experience, you must be lying. He's invalidating anyone who disagrees ahead of time. Well I guess here goes my lie.

I won't argue the dumb semantics of whether this game is P2W or P4C. That goes nowhere. But I will argue against this idea that P2W has a monopoly on all the best grind spots, leaving all other players in the dust with no possibility to catch up. 

I consistently find myself uninterrupted while grinding. And when someone takes the spot from me, I'm sure to find another good spot nearby and out of the way. It's a brief moment that I move on from quickly with the worst case scenario being one loading screen.

I really wonder what you PK magnets are doing. People like you either keep getting in people's rotation, complain in chat making yourself a target for trolls, or exaggerate your experience after getting PKed a couple of times acting like you're being victimized.

And really? Comparing an MMO's way of balance to a Competitive Shooter's balance. What's next? Comparing the strength of BDO's classes to the strength of units in a Strategy game?

PA know this game will probably have a very short lifespan on Xbox  that's why they're rushing content and drip feeding us with gear upgrades and equipment. At this point they just want to make as much money as possible while the game lasts.

Yep one of the most straight up p2w games on the market rn(excluding f2p games) although still enjoyable tbh. I still play regularly and I criticize their shady business practices pretty often.  Careful with the p2w talk though. Pearl Abyss fanboys/hopeful employees get extremely butthurt and sensitive when criticizing their precious game. 

13 hours ago, Jason said:

as those who do not pay will NEVER catch up or be able to grind in the top spots as those who pay

Never. You know there is a cap at PEN. 10 billion dollars wont get me past PEN on anything. So saying NEVER is a crock of garbage because given enough time other dedicated players will get there.

How about MrPaytoWin who makes 50 attempts at PEN and fails them all but joe nobody trying to build a tet stack pops PEN on a 36 stack(see the video of the flag up guy) in 1 try. Where is the P2W there.

You do realize there is a limit to buying costumes per week to sell. So that 250-300m a week advantage seems massive to some right now, but how is that any different once sea monster hunting comes out and guilds can make billions a day and give max payouts

1 hour ago, OKAYIGETITNOW said:

PA know this game will probably have a very short lifespan on Xbox  that's why they're rushing content and drip feeding us with gear upgrades and equipment. At this point they just want to make as much money as possible while the game lasts.

Do your research. PA is rushing us content because they want to get all regions and platforms caught up to the same patch update and start doing universal updates across the board.

Pretty much. When a sea monster eats your boat, and you're stuck on an island with nothing but the gods and a starfish for company, that gear score and money isn't going to matter much until a friend comes to get you. Then, when you ask for help in chat, someone else will come to 'get' you. Or you could drown yourself and resurrect in the nearest town that hopefully has a wharf.

15 minutes ago, Hieraphant said:

Never. You know there is a cap at PEN. 10 billion dollars wont get me past PEN on anything. So saying NEVER is a crock of garbage because given enough time other dedicated players will get there.

 

How about MrPaytoWin who makes 50 attempts at PEN and fails them all but joe nobody trying to build a tet stack pops PEN on a 36 stack(see the video of the flag up guy) in 1 try. Where is the P2W there.

 

You do realize there is a limit to buying costumes per week to sell. So that 250-300m a week advantage seems massive to some right now, but how is that any different once sea monster hunting comes out and guilds can make billions a day and give max payouts

Do your research. PA is rushing us content because they want to get all regions and platforms caught up to the same patch update and start doing universal updates across the board.

Right now it isn't about selling costumes but extracting them

27 minutes ago, Hieraphant said:

Never. You know there is a cap at PEN. 10 billion dollars wont get me past PEN on anything. So saying NEVER is a crock of garbage because given enough time other dedicated players will get there.

 

How about MrPaytoWin who makes 50 attempts at PEN and fails them all but joe nobody trying to build a tet stack pops PEN on a 36 stack(see the video of the flag up guy) in 1 try. Where is the P2W there.

 

You do realize there is a limit to buying costumes per week to sell. So that 250-300m a week advantage seems massive to some right now, but how is that any different once sea monster hunting comes out and guilds can make billions a day and give max payouts

Do your research. PA is rushing us content because they want to get all regions and platforms caught up to the same patch update and start doing universal updates across the board.

Isn't the game dead on pc anyway? I heard all that's left is life skillers and role players getting off on erp, so why rush it and not just let people enjoy the content without constantly chasing their tail with rapid gear and skill progression.

You do realise that people who pay to win don't buy costumes for the gold resale price right? They buy them for the crons because the material value is like 186m silver per costume and that doesn't have a limited.

It won't be long until they adjust the price of the cm costumes prices like pc. I believe it's like 250m on pc per costume. I seen someone saying that's like a TET boss item per week on the CM if you sell 5 costumes.

So get your facts right before you try to justify the game not being P2W you rocket!

9 minutes ago, Primus said:

Pretty much. When a sea monster eats your boat, and you're stuck on an island with nothing but the gods and a starfish for company, that gear score and money isn't going to matter much until a friend comes to get you. Then, when you ask for help in chat, someone else will come to 'get' you. Or you could drown yourself and resurrect in the nearest town that hopefully has a wharf.

You can repair the sailboat/frigate at sea, you can recover it's stamina while at sea. If you are not a dumba** you won't have your boat destroyed. Then when Margoria drops they have a destress signal you can buy that summons a boat to take you back to Lema or Illya Island (not sure which one of those)

Also ill just put this info here any you all can take it how you all want: My friend has 263 AP mystic level 61, He does lifeskills, SMH for the 500mil weekly payout, and grinds Hystria. He makes about 1 bil a week and still hardly progresses. People like MrPayToWin who is blowing absurd mounts of money per enchant is going to hit a wall I do not even think his wallet will want to keep going with. Sure the "easy" enchants of croning PEN weapons and armors he can do pretty quick (but these armors and weapons will also some day sit on the market). But when he has to start spending 8bil - 12bil to save ONE accessory attempt he will start feeling that hurt his wallet more than a 1-2 bil TET attempt. Sure, he's a cocky SoB as i've seen in world chat but gear wont make players like him everything. Someone with full TET who only spent a few hundred on the game will easily compete with him when the time comes.

Example go look up Bong from KR he was 285+ wizard getting dunked by 250-260AP players in his time. 

First you p2w folk wanna jump on the band wagon that buying costumes to sell was p2w. Now you say thats the case and its for the crons. Again i refer u to MrPayToWin and the 50 failed PEN attempts vs the 1 tap at 36 fs.  

Convienance for safety with crons, but not a guarenteed PEN. And even cronning accessories can downgrade them.

Ooooh... that sounds good. Do the distress beacons act like teleport stones or do you actually have to sit in a little boat all the way to port? Because if that's the case then you're still pretty vulnerable, right?

1 minute ago, Primus said:

Ooooh... that sounds good. Do the distress beacons act like teleport stones or do you actually have to sit in a little boat all the way to port? Because if that's the case then you're still pretty vulnerable, right?

 

No its not a TP, The boat arrives and then you sit and wait out the ride. This boat is just as fast as a base Epheria Sailboat so it wont take long and Sea Monsters cant keep up with it, so you are completely safe.

1 hour ago, Hieraphant said:

First you p2w folk wanna jump on the band wagon that buying costumes to sell was p2w. Now you say thats the case and its for the crons. Again i refer u to MrPayToWin and the 50 failed PEN attempts vs the 1 tap at 36 fs.  

 

Convienance for safety with crons, but not a guarenteed PEN. And even cronning accessories can downgrade them.

 

 

Honestly unless they directly put a PEN item on the cash shop for $1000 theres no way to convince people like you that it's not pay for convenience. You're too thick in the head to see that being able to buy unlimited amounts of costumes to have virtually unlimited TET/PEN attempts is basically selling item levels with RNG gambling.

I don't think anyone is denying that if you play for long enough you will eventually get at a minimum full TET & Tri accessories. This could be in 6-12 months depending on how active you are. When someone can achieve what takes the average player 6-12 months in 3 days from the cash shop they're paying with real money to progress, which is indeed winning in every aspect of the game apart from life skills & workers/nodes (and guess what you can pay to win in those too).

You can't use 1 extremely lucky guy as an example for PEN attempts as a comparison to multiple people having access to virtually unlimited PEN attempts if they're willing to spend the cash and guess what theres probably hundreds of people that have done that already to get ahead.

The P2W is just so expensive that it's not a realistic arguement. 

Unlimited costumes for crons, is expensive .

Most people use money for convenience, good number of people.

People point at the 1% and say that is the norm, it's not. It's just keeping the lights on, so we ignore them honestly.

Face it: It’s PayToPlay, PayForConveinance, and P2W PvP.  If you want any decent PvE may as well pay a sub fee to any other PvE centric game. Superior PvP on Xbox can be had for FREE in Fortnite (and many other existing titles on XB). The BDO gambling device is a canker sore on video games.  Like, not one person arguing against these P2W threads ever mentions not spending a dime, it’s always something, usually ‘just a few hundred’...after you already paid to play the game. Let that sink in.  ?

....did that guy really just say you can p2w in lifeskills? 

13 minutes ago, Yiazzy said:

....did that guy really just say you can p2w in lifeskills? 

Groundhog is decent money maker, I have t4.

Cooking outfit saves you hours s day cooking.

 processing outfit quadruples your afk time.

These were not able to be bought with silver, honestly the only true P2W in the whole game.

19 minutes ago, Yiazzy said:

....did that guy really just say you can p2w in lifeskills? 

Costumes, pets, scrolls/books can all directly effect your life skills. It doesn't directly effect the game in a negative way because it's solely to make the game easier for yourself.

You're paying for items that directly make the game mechanics easier i.e you're winning in some regards to a player that doesn't have 4x T3 life skill pets and specific costumes for a given task. Better efficiency = faster progression & more silver.

3 hours ago, OKAYIGETITNOW said:

Costumes, pets, scrolls/books can all directly effect your life skills. It doesn't directly effect the game in a negative way because it's solely to make the game easier for yourself.

You're paying for items that directly make the game mechanics easier i.e you're winning in some regards to a player that doesn't have 4x T3 life skill pets and specific costumes for a given task. Better efficiency = faster progression & more silver.

Oh, so you can't throw money for easy Guru level in all lifeskills and immediately gain all knowledge needed for processing. 

In other words, you're full of it. Gotcha ?

30 minutes ago, Yiazzy said:

Oh, so you can't throw money for easy Guru level in all lifeskills and immediately gain all knowledge needed for processing. 

In other words, you're full of it. Gotcha ?

Nah mate you're the one that's full of it. You come in with your garbage fanboy attitude about how the game is pay for convenience with no solid arguments. Pretty much everything you say gets proven wrong by multiple people.

At this point I'm starting to think you're trolling or just plainly not that smart.

4 minutes ago, OKAYIGETITNOW said:

Nah mate you're the one that's full of it. You come in with your garbage fanboy attitude about how the game is pay for convenience with no solid arguments. Pretty much everything you say gets proven wrong by multiple people.

At this point I'm starting to think you're trolling or just plainly not that smart.

For the very last time, I'll break it down for you. 

Is Pen gear ONLY obtainable by paying money? As in, the game will not let you upgrade from Tet unless you spend? No? 

THAT'S why it's not p2w, and why it's pay for convenience. You pay to shorten the time it would take to get said gear. You don't pay for something that is unavailable otherwise. 

And if that very simple summary, isn't enough to educate you and others of the same opinion, there's no hope. 

And in the spirit of your last message, at this point I'm starting to think that this game has attracted a load of brain dead children. No wonder the school system's gone to hell. 

2 minutes ago, OKAYIGETITNOW said:

Nah mate you're the one that's full of it. You come in with your garbage fanboy attitude about how the game is pay for convenience with no solid arguments. Pretty much everything you say gets proven wrong by multiple people.

At this point I'm starting to think you're trolling or just plainly not that smart.

He’s a gambling addict, let em be.  This is a game for them, like craps or poker. It’s unfortunate people expecting a decent mmorpg were lured in by deceptive advertising. ‘Be your true self’ lol. 

Hey, remember when before launch we were told that standard pre-launch edition was the lowest entry point, even post launch, and then BAM, day 1, $10 edition is out on MS store?  Pepperidge Farms remembers.

Just now, Hardcore said:

He’s a gambling addict, let em be.  This is a game for them, like craps or poker. It’s unfortunate people expecting a decent mmorpg were lured in by deceptive advertising. ‘Be your true self’ lol. 

Hey, remember when before launch we were told that standard pre-launch edition was the lowest entry point, even post launch, and then BAM, day 1, $10 edition is out on MS store?  Pepperidge Farms remembers.

Yep, I paid £8 for the game. Your point? 

And it's hard to be a gambling addict when my time on the game is spent lifeskilling....but hey, whatever makes you think you're relevant.